Extract from the transcript of Padraig O'Malley's interview with then ANC Secretary General, Kgalema Motlanthe, September 15 2000

PADRAIG O'MALLEY: OK this is the last question. They say, and this comes back to where our conversation began six weeks ago. They say the government is not doing enough about AIDS and I agree, I don't think the government is, to be honest with you.

KGALEMA MOTLANTHE: Well they are wrong. I'll tell you why. You see, and this is one of the things that would explain to you how racism manifests itself outside of the law because now you see we've removed all the racial laws but the legacy of racism, more especially in the realm of ideas, is still very much with us and the former ruling bloc controls the mass media in this country and they have deliberately - and I will explain to you in one sentence what our position is with regard to AIDS.

AIDS is acquired immune deficiency syndrome. Now that means your body defence mechanism is down and out, it's a condition in a human body. Our understanding of that is that TB if not treated, if you contract TB and it's not treated it eats away and lowers your immune system to a point where it can actually lead to AIDS once your immune system has completely collapsed. But TB would also be regarded as an opportunistic disease, that once malaria, another disease, has caused a decline of your body defence system, when you contract TB your body will not be able to defeat TB and therefore that condition would be described as AIDS. So there are about 30 odd different diseases that are regarded as opportunistic diseases which would kill you if your immune system has collapsed.

There's a virus called HIV which is one of 69 possible causes of the collapse of the body immune system and our position is that from all accounts this virus has not been isolated and photographed and studied under controlled conditions as to what it's behaviour is. Therefore it remains one of the many causes and not the sole cause of AIDS and therefore the response to AIDS is informed by that totally, that there is ongoing research work by scientists to try and isolate this virus.

Now there are people who are driven by pharmaceuticals who say that that question must never be asked because pharmaceuticals produce drugs on the basis that HIV causes AIDS, period. It is the only cause of AIDS and that's it. Any other question, you are a dissident, you are bad, you are malicious, you are dangerous to society, you will be responsible for the deaths of so many children and this and that and so on. It's all crap from the pharmaceuticals. That's our view and I can give you another example.

 I had a meeting with the leadership in Uganda. A few years ago the figures of people who were reported to be HIV positive and suffering from AIDS were huge. It was like Uganda's population was going to be wiped away. And they said to me when I said, "What have you done to turn this thing around?" they said to me, "No, the figures were exaggerated in the first place. We have just continued with our normal - "

PADRAIG O'MALLEY:  ... drug?

KGALEMA MOTLANTHE:  No, the statistics were -

PADRAIG O'MALLEY:  But generated by the drug industry?

KGALEMA MOTLANTHE: Yes, were exaggerated. So that if you were to pull them out now and do your own calculations there shouldn't be anybody walking around in Uganda now. But because the population is still there they had to find an explanation and the only explanation they could find was that Uganda has succeeded to turn this thing around. They won't tell you what the Ugandans have done, they will not, because they have continuously said, "We've continued with awareness programmes, prevention programmes and so on", which is what we are doing here and the government has done a great deal on that.

What the government has refused to do, for which it's being maligned and crucified today, it refused to be railroaded into contracting with Glaxo-Wellcome for the supplies of AZT, a drug called AZT, which everybody said AZT must be prescribed for pregnant mothers, for raped women. The government has refused because the drug is expensive and it turns out that it was not developed for that purpose. The scientists say so.

Glaxo-Wellcome have said that it was licensed for that but because they had mobilised the entire media and so on they were able, of course, to create a picture that the government is not committed, doesn't care because they repeat lies. But like everything in life the truth will out on this matter and that's why we are not concerned. We know what we have to do, we must continue to ensure that our people practice A, B, C, they abstain, they remain loyal to one partner and they condomise as some kind of prevention from spreading the disease and also that once people have contracted this disease they should still be treated for the opportunistic diseases. TB is curable to the extent that if somebody shows symptoms of TB they must be treated for TB. It shouldn't be labelled as AIDS and therefore as there is no cure for AIDS, therefore you're condemned to death. That's our position.

PADRAIG O'MALLEY:  Do you think, again, that whites use this in a racist kind of way to whop the ANC?

KGALEMA MOTLANTHE:  No, they are gullible. You see half of them don't read but they regard themselves as well informed because they're white. The reason why when you ask - you ask any of the experts whether they have seen evidence, any piece of document that says scientist so-and-so in such a country has isolated this HIV virus and photographed it and studied it's modus vivendi under controlled conditions, they will swear at you.

They will tell you that question was answered twenty years ago, they will tell you you are giving audience to dissidents. They will not tell you because it's not there. That's why they become vicious because it is simply not there. They take it on authority and then it gets passed on like that but there's no authority, it's a lie repeated by those who are supposed to know better. The truth of the matter is that if they were to admit that indeed no such thing has happened, I mean it would cause serious reverberations across the scientific world.

PADRAIG O'MALLEY:  They'd all be out of a job.

KGALEMA MOTLANTHE:  Yes. It would be like when Galileo invented the telescope and said the earth is not flat after all, it's round, it caused serious reverberations. That's what will happen with this thing.

PADRAIG O'MALLEY:  I must thank you very much. I appreciate the time you have given me.

Source:www.omalley.co.za

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